View Full Version : The future of MSIE support for Mac OS X


Alberto Cristancho
07-23-2003, 06:21 PM
I've heard rumors that Microsoft will stop supporting development of
Internet Explorer for the Mac in the near future. I would guess that
this is due in part to Apple's new browser, Safari, which directly
competes with IE. There are many websites that are "optimized" for IE,
and not having IE as an option for the Mac OS could have significant
repercussions. Does anyone care to elaborate on this topic? I'm
interested in finding out accurate information regarding what we can
expect and what options are available.

Harri Mellin
07-23-2003, 09:40 PM
In article <2e9f46e4.0307230921.16cf7292[at]posting.google.com>,
acristancho[at]toda.net (Alberto Cristancho) wrote:

> I've heard rumors that Microsoft will stop supporting development of
> Internet Explorer for the Mac in the near future. I would guess that
> this is due in part to Apple's new browser, Safari, which directly
> competes with IE. There are many websites that are "optimized" for IE,
> and not having IE as an option for the Mac OS could have significant
> repercussions. Does anyone care to elaborate on this topic? I'm
> interested in finding out accurate information regarding what we can
> expect and what options are available.

Ms Ie is allready dead (no more updates) and the msie for mac website is gone

--
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Mickey Stevens
07-23-2003, 10:25 PM
On 7/23/03 3:40 PM, in article
atz02-45AF4D.22405123072003[at]msnews.microsoft.com, "Harri Mellin"
<atz02[at]netscape.net> wrote:

> In article <2e9f46e4.0307230921.16cf7292[at]posting.google.com>,
> acristancho[at]toda.net (Alberto Cristancho) wrote:
>
>> I've heard rumors that Microsoft will stop supporting development of
>> Internet Explorer for the Mac in the near future. I would guess that
>> this is due in part to Apple's new browser, Safari, which directly
>> competes with IE. There are many websites that are "optimized" for IE,
>> and not having IE as an option for the Mac OS could have significant
>> repercussions. Does anyone care to elaborate on this topic? I'm
>> interested in finding out accurate information regarding what we can
>> expect and what options are available.
>
> Ms Ie is allready dead (no more updates)

Correct. Microsoft issued a press release a few weeks ago that officially
announced the end of Internet Explorer for Mac development. However, future
updates for bug and security fixes may still appear.

> and the msie for mac website is gone

I'm still seeing it.
http://www.microsoft.com/mac/products/internetexplorer/internetexplorer.aspx

--
Mickey Stevens (Microsoft MVP for Office:mac)
PowerPoint FAQ featuring PowerPoint:mac: <http://www.pptfaq.com/>
Entourage Help Page: <http://www.entourage.mvps.org/toc.html>

Harri Mellin
07-23-2003, 11:32 PM
In article <BB44676C.17A39%mickey.stevens[at]mvps.org>,
Mickey Stevens <mickey.stevens[at]mvps.org> wrote:

> > and the msie for mac website is gone
>
> I'm still seeing it.
> http://www.microsoft.com/mac/products/internetexplorer/internetexplorer.aspx

i clicked the msie logo in the corner of the browser window

http://www.microsoft.com/mac/ie/


Sorry, there is no Microsoft.com web page matching your request. It is
possible you typed the address incorrectly, or that the page no longer
exists. As an option, you may visit any of the pages below for information
about Microsoft services and products.

--
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Swedish Webcams <http://zap.to/webcams>
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Mickey Stevens
07-24-2003, 12:00 AM
On 7/23/03 5:32 PM, in article
atz02-ABE339.00324624072003[at]msnews.microsoft.com, "Harri Mellin"
<atz02[at]netscape.net> wrote:

> In article <BB44676C.17A39%mickey.stevens[at]mvps.org>,
> Mickey Stevens <mickey.stevens[at]mvps.org> wrote:
>
>>> and the msie for mac website is gone
>>
>> I'm still seeing it.
>> http://www.microsoft.com/mac/products/internetexplorer/internetexplorer.aspx
>
> i clicked the msie logo in the corner of the browser window
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/mac/ie/
>
>
> Sorry, there is no Microsoft.com web page matching your request. It is
> possible you typed the address incorrectly, or that the page no longer
> exists. As an option, you may visit any of the pages below for information
> about Microsoft services and products.

Oh. It's a shame they didn't put up re-director links. Now all of the
download links I had posted no longer work also.

--
Mickey Stevens (Microsoft MVP for Office:mac)
PowerPoint FAQ featuring PowerPoint:mac: <http://www.pptfaq.com/>
Entourage Help Page: <http://www.entourage.mvps.org/toc.html>

Harri Mellin
07-24-2003, 12:32 AM
In article <BB447DCA.17A86%mickey.stevens[at]mvps.org>,
Mickey Stevens <mickey.stevens[at]mvps.org> wrote:

> Oh. It's a shame they didn't put up re-director links. Now all of the
> download links I had posted no longer work also.

good website owners makes a redirect link to the new location. bad website
owners gives you a 404

--
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Swedish Webcams <http://zap.to/webcams>
-------------------------------------------

Charles Tomaras
07-24-2003, 01:47 AM
"Harri Mellin" <atz02[at]netscape.net> wrote in message
news:atz02-D2EF70.01323724072003[at]msnews.microsoft.com...
> In article <BB447DCA.17A86%mickey.stevens[at]mvps.org>,
> Mickey Stevens <mickey.stevens[at]mvps.org> wrote:
>
> > Oh. It's a shame they didn't put up re-director links. Now all of the
> > download links I had posted no longer work also.
>
> good website owners makes a redirect link to the new location. bad website
> owners gives you a 404

Now MS has pissed off what's left of the 3% of the computer users who use
Mac and IE that visit their site!

William M. Smith
07-24-2003, 02:16 AM
On 7/23/03 12:21 PM, "Alberto Cristancho" <acristancho[at]toda.net> wrote:

> I've heard rumors that Microsoft will stop supporting development of
> Internet Explorer for the Mac in the near future. I would guess that
> this is due in part to Apple's new browser, Safari, which directly
> competes with IE. There are many websites that are "optimized" for IE,
> and not having IE as an option for the Mac OS could have significant
> repercussions. Does anyone care to elaborate on this topic? I'm
> interested in finding out accurate information regarding what we can
> expect and what options are available.

Hi Alberto!

Here's my two cents...

The death of Mac IE is only an evolution, not a catastrophe. And like
Darwin's theory of evolution, those who don't evolve will die out.

Sites aren't necessarily optimized for one browser over another (although
some say they are).

They are simply tested in the most common one or two browsers available. And
quite often, they are tested with the most common browsers only on the
platform on which they've been built (Mac or Windows).

When I've tested projects, I've included:

IE for Mac and Windows
Netscape for Mac and Windows
Mozilla
Opera
Safari
AOL (since a broad base of Internet users don't know anything else)

This isn't everything, but from these I can find the least common
denominators that will work well for all of them and making the HTML work
with all of them is just a matter of tweaking, not major rewriting.

I've seen several commercial websites (such as http://www.wellsfargo.com)
adapt their sites to work with Safari when their sites wouldn't initially
support Safari. This is smart business for them. They recognize the
evolution and are reacting.

Users creating homepages do so mostly in ignorance of whether or not their
pages will display properly to most people. I would dare say most don't care
so long as they and their closest relations can read the pages. No big deal.
They've appealed to their total audience.

I speculate that any sites worth visiting (and who want you to continue to
visit) will adapt or die long before the Mac community sees the last of its
days. I'll miss IE because I thought it was and excellent browser, but
another will eventually take its place. Apple is betting it will be Safari.

bill
--
William M. Smith
(Microsoft Interop MVP)

mbar
07-24-2003, 10:57 PM
"William M. Smith" <mecklists[at]REMOVETHIS.mn.rr.com> wrote in message news:<BB449D9B.1053B%mecklists[at]REMOVETHIS.mn.rr.com>...
> On 7/23/03 12:21 PM, "Alberto Cristancho" <acristancho[at]toda.net> wrote:
>
> > I've heard rumors that Microsoft will stop supporting development of
> > Internet Explorer for the Mac in the near future. I would guess that
> > this is due in part to Apple's new browser, Safari, which directly
> > competes with IE. There are many websites that are "optimized" for IE,
> > and not having IE as an option for the Mac OS could have significant
> > repercussions. Does anyone care to elaborate on this topic? I'm
> > interested in finding out accurate information regarding what we can
> > expect and what options are available.
>
> Hi Alberto!
>
> Here's my two cents...
>
> The death of Mac IE is only an evolution, not a catastrophe. And like
> Darwin's theory of evolution, those who don't evolve will die out.
>
> Sites aren't necessarily optimized for one browser over another (although
> some say they are).
>
> They are simply tested in the most common one or two browsers available. And
> quite often, they are tested with the most common browsers only on the
> platform on which they've been built (Mac or Windows).
>
> When I've tested projects, I've included:
>
> IE for Mac and Windows
> Netscape for Mac and Windows
> Mozilla
> Opera
> Safari
> AOL (since a broad base of Internet users don't know anything else)
>
> This isn't everything, but from these I can find the least common
> denominators that will work well for all of them and making the HTML work
> with all of them is just a matter of tweaking, not major rewriting.
>
> I've seen several commercial websites (such as http://www.wellsfargo.com)
> adapt their sites to work with Safari when their sites wouldn't initially
> support Safari. This is smart business for them. They recognize the
> evolution and are reacting.
>
> Users creating homepages do so mostly in ignorance of whether or not their
> pages will display properly to most people. I would dare say most don't care
> so long as they and their closest relations can read the pages. No big deal.
> They've appealed to their total audience.
>
> I speculate that any sites worth visiting (and who want you to continue to
> visit) will adapt or die long before the Mac community sees the last of its
> days. I'll miss IE because I thought it was and excellent browser, but
> another will eventually take its place. Apple is betting it will be Safari.
>
> bill


I agree with you to some point but in practice we all have to
understand that fewer and fewer organizations are even considering
apple os in both www development and also evolving software
development...
"I speculate that any sites worth visiting (and who want you to
continue to
visit) will adapt or die long before the Mac community sees the last
of its
days". I would like to believe this but in practice large corporations
are not exactly falling over themselves to provide for apple
users:example is verizon wireless.com ( see my post ). Look at Adobe..
they started with apple and only provided apps for the mac... Recently
it provided the latest Acrobat version to windows way before Apple..
just in the last several months has Acrobat 6.0 come out for osx. Over
the last 15 years I have been an apple person but am now wondering
about the advantage... I feel that for myself os x has created more
problems than it solved and is now feeling like MS anyway... Mac os is
no longer the leader in performance in the 2/d and 3/d design
profession... so other than being able to download mp3 to my ipod.. so
what.. I dislike MS very much but life is short and a computer is only
a tool... not a religious icon.

William M. Smith
07-25-2003, 04:35 AM
On 7/24/03 4:57 PM, "mbar" <mbartemp[at]earthlink.net> wrote:

> I agree with you to some point but in practice we all have to
> understand that fewer and fewer organizations are even considering
> apple os in both www development and also evolving software
> development...
> "I speculate that any sites worth visiting (and who want you to
> continue to
> visit) will adapt or die long before the Mac community sees the last
> of its
> days". I would like to believe this but in practice large corporations
> are not exactly falling over themselves to provide for apple
> users:example is verizon wireless.com ( see my post ). Look at Adobe..
> they started with apple and only provided apps for the mac... Recently
> it provided the latest Acrobat version to windows way before Apple..
> just in the last several months has Acrobat 6.0 come out for osx. Over
> the last 15 years I have been an apple person but am now wondering
> about the advantage... I feel that for myself os x has created more
> problems than it solved and is now feeling like MS anyway... Mac os is
> no longer the leader in performance in the 2/d and 3/d design
> profession... so other than being able to download mp3 to my ipod.. so
> what.. I dislike MS very much but life is short and a computer is only
> a tool... not a religious icon.

My response was only to the question of how the demise of IE for Mac will
affect the Mac community.

The other points you raise are very valid, but in a different context.

So long as there is Microsoft or any other overwhelmingly dominant entity,
there will be those who rebel against it. The size of an elephant will
always be determined by the size of the mouse next to it.

While I don't believe that businesses will always cater to Macs per se, I do
believe they will always cater to the mouse. It's the mouse that provides
those profitability margins.

Apple is the mouse right now and I still speculate that there will be
businesses that will fail, because they didn't cater to the Mac, long before
the Mac dies.

Now I'll throw in something interesting... If Microsoft is the elephant and
Apple is the mouse, then where does open source (Linux, Unix, Apache, MySQL,
etc.) fit in? Planet? That mouse has a pretty sizable big brother.

This is only a third cent. bill
--
William M. Smith
(Microsoft Interop MVP)

Charles Tomaras
07-25-2003, 05:54 AM
I thought this article I read today was kind of interesting on the future of
Apple.

http://www.sunspot.net/technology/custom/pluggedin/bal-mac072403,0,7911674.column?coll=bal-business-indepth

Jeff Grossman
07-27-2003, 10:26 PM
Harri Mellin <atz02[at]netscape.net> wrote:
> In article <2e9f46e4.0307230921.16cf7292[at]posting.google.com>,
> acristancho[at]toda.net (Alberto Cristancho) wrote:
>
>> I've heard rumors that Microsoft will stop supporting development of
>> Internet Explorer for the Mac in the near future. I would guess that
>> this is due in part to Apple's new browser, Safari, which directly
>> competes with IE. There are many websites that are "optimized" for IE,
>> and not having IE as an option for the Mac OS could have significant
>> repercussions. Does anyone care to elaborate on this topic? I'm
>> interested in finding out accurate information regarding what we can
>> expect and what options are available.
>
> Ms Ie is allready dead (no more updates) and the msie for mac website is gone
>

I was just able to go to the following website with no problems.
http://www.microsoft.com/mac/products/internetexplorer/internetexplorer.aspx?pid=internetexplorer

Yes, the development is dead, but they will continue to support it.

Jeff
--
Jeff Grossman (jeff[at]stikman.com)

Curious George
08-10-2003, 05:28 PM
All the antidotal comments aside, how do I access sites that are IE
5.5 specific? Do I have to become a Windows user?
Thanks.
George

Jeff Grossman <jeff[at]stikman.com> wrote in message news:<8isdvx189.ln2[at]stikman.com>...
> Alberto Cristancho <acristancho[at]toda.net> wrote:
> > I've heard rumors that Microsoft will stop supporting development of
> > Internet Explorer for the Mac in the near future. I would guess that
> > this is due in part to Apple's new browser, Safari, which directly
> > competes with IE. There are many websites that are "optimized" for IE,
> > and not having IE as an option for the Mac OS could have significant
> > repercussions. Does anyone care to elaborate on this topic? I'm
> > interested in finding out accurate information regarding what we can
> > expect and what options are available.
>
> Actually, Microsoft has already announced that they have stopped
> development of IE for the Mac. They said they will continue to support it
> and release any security releases that are necessary. But, the
> development of any new versions is gone. Microsoft claims that since
> Apple has complete control over the operating system, they cannot compete
> against them in the browser market.
>
> Jeff

William M. Smith
08-10-2003, 11:43 PM
On 8/10/03 11:28 AM, "Curious George" <geoflorida[at]aol.com> wrote:

> All the antidotal comments aside, how do I access sites that are IE
> 5.5 specific? Do I have to become a Windows user?
> Thanks.
> George

Hi George!

Sites become Windows-specific for two reasons.

1.) The site developers have built the site using non-standard code (HTML,
XHTML, etc.) and have tested only using browsers on a Windows system to make
it work. This would be IE 5.5 and 6.0 in most cases.

Most web browsers have little quirks about how they render the web page
coding. Some are more lax in their rendering than others.

IE is lax in its interpretation of standard code and will ignore some
improper coding. But if IE is the only browser tested with the code, you can
almost guarantee that it won't show up properly in other browsers.

Safari is less lax in its interpretation and so you'll quite often see more
problems with it. But it is correctly interpreting the code.

A good site developer endeavers to write code that will be viewable on a
variety of platforms, browsers and versions of browsers, not just IE.

2.) The site developer has incorporated into his site something that is
Windows-specific.

A good example is ActiveX. It has been used for online chats on the MSN
website. Only a Windows user will be able to participate in these chats
because ActiveX drives the chats. ActiveX will run only on Windows and not
on Mac or Unix or any other platform.

So, in some cases, George, you do have to use Windows to use some websites.
But I haven't found any yet that I can't live without. Certainly, none of
them merit enough to purchase a Windows system just for that reason.

Hope this help! bill
--
William M. Smith
(Microsoft Interop MVP)

Harri Mellin
08-11-2003, 12:22 PM
In article <1a441dbd.0308101938.1db33b04[at]posting.google.com>,
geoflorida[at]aol.com (Curious George) wrote:

> Thanks for the information, Bill. However, I am a realtor, and cannot
> access this integral site:
>
> http://sef.mlxchange.com/
>
> Also, my bank, "Bank of America," just announced that as of January 1,
> 2004 you will need to use IE 5.5 to access 'on line banking.'
>
> Thus, I am being forced to become a windows user.
> Regards,
> George

complain to them that you can't use their services and that you don't wan't
to go over to windows and msie 5.5+ doesn't exist on mac

--
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Swedish Webcams http://zap.to/webcams
-------------------------------------------

s.becker
09-14-2003, 12:53 AM
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THE FORWARDED LETTER

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Post this article as a new message by highlighting the text of this letter
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on to every letter and mailing list request you receive. They will be proof
of your service.



HOW THIS WORKS
When you send out 200 Posts, it is estimated that at least 15 people will
respond and send you a $1.00 to be placed on your mailing list ($15.00).
Those 15 will Post 200 Posts each and 225 people send you $1.00 to be placed
on your mailing list ($225.00). Those 225 people Post 200 Posts each and
3,375 people send you $1.00 to be placed on your mailing list ($3,375.00)
Those 3,375 post 200 posts each and 50,625 people send you $1.00 each
($50,625). Those 50,625 post 200 posts each and 759,375 people send you
$1.00 ($759,375.00) At this point your name drops off the list, but so far
you have received $813,615.00. Plus, you will continue to increase your
income when you sell the mailing lists. Even if less then 15 people respond
each time, you will still receive an income in the tens of thousands of
dollars. The reality is, even if you only made a few hundred dollars out of
all this, that's still an excellent return for such a miniscule investment.
Most people spend a lot more on lottery tickets and have nothing to show for
it, and forget about
how much money is needed to play the market. Also, after posting this
message on 100 mesage boards, it may get boring.
Stay focused on what you want and don't quit until you finish.


P.S.
This program remains successful because of the honesty and integrity of the
participants and by their carefully adhering to the directions. Look at it
this way. If you are of integrity, the program will continue and the money
that so many others have received will come your way.

When your money begins to come in, give the first 10% to charity with spirit
and share a good fortune!



ADDRESSES TO SEND YOUR PAYMENT OF 1 DOLLAR EACH TO (THROUGH YOUR PAYPAL
ACCOUNT) AND THE MAILING LIST REQUEST:

IF YOU OPEN A PAYPAL ACCOUNT BEFORE THE LAST SEPTEMBER PAYPAL WILL GIVE YOU
FIVE DOLLAR AS A BONUS SO THIS WILL NOT COST YOU ANYTHING!!!


1)
Alex O'Leary
alexander.oleary[at]gamebox.net
8377 APT. I MONTGOMERY RUN RD.
ELLICOTT CITY MD 21043

2)
Ralph H Sweeney
ralph.sweeney[at]bonbon.net

3)
Dick Baldwin, Santa Monica
baldwin33[at]toughguy.net

4)
Clark Olsen, Minnesota
clark.olsen[at]hotpop.com

5)
Sarah Becker
sarah.becker[at]bonbon.net
Homestead, Fl 33033