John Croft wrote:
> Has any body else experienced this problem or know how to fix it?

maybe something similar.

I recently got a external hard disk case with Firewire and USB2
connectors, put my ex-internal 10GB disk in it and connected it to my
iBook (same as yours). The disk showed up and I could copy some stuff.
Then suddenly, it disappeared and since then I couldn't use it with
Firewire anymore, it would never mount or even be detected. Using the
USB connector, it worked.
The case has an Oxford 911 chipset. Sent it back to the dealer, who
supposedly got it working (not sure if he really tried it with
firewire). No resolve yet.

Dennis

In article <bds40v$108il7$1[at]ID-34660.news.dfncis.de>, Dennis Luemkemann
<dennis.luemkemann[at]gmx.de> wrote:

> John Croft wrote:
> > Has any body else experienced this problem or know how to fix it?
>
> maybe something similar.
>
> I recently got a external hard disk case with Firewire and USB2
> connectors, put my ex-internal 10GB disk in it and connected it to my
> iBook (same as yours). The disk showed up and I could copy some stuff.
> Then suddenly, it disappeared and since then I couldn't use it with
> Firewire anymore, it would never mount or even be detected. Using the
> USB connector, it worked.

I did some research and discovered that a faulty cable or drive can fry
your FireWire port -- this is what has happened to mine. Actually, the
FW chip is on the logic board, so to get FireWire going again I would
have to have that replaced, which all up would be over £400 -- not
really worth it for my old iBook.

Seems like a slightly deficient technology, if one faulty cable can
cook your logic board...I hope this isn't the case with yours.

John

John Croft <j.croft[at]sussex.ac.uk> wrote in message news:<010720031818387172%j.croft[at]sussex.ac.uk>...
>
> I did some research and discovered that a faulty cable or drive can fry
> your FireWire port -- this is what has happened to mine. Actually, the
> FW chip is on the logic board, so to get FireWire going again I would

External connects like this are usually linked to the rest of the
circuit through surface-mounted chokes. It is *likely* (though not
certain by any means) that it is simply these chokes that have been
burned out. At a pinch you could replace them with a wire link.
Pullup/pulldown resistors on those lines might also be open-circuit.

If the FireWire host adapter IC is fried, then of course you're in a
bad situation, but it's a better than even chance that it's a simple
passive component(s) that's dead.

In article <608b6569.0307011306.5ff38d43[at]posting.google.com>, Lewin
A.R.W. Edwards <larwe[at]larwe.com> wrote:

> John Croft <j.croft[at]sussex.ac.uk> wrote in message
> news:<010720031818387172%j.croft[at]sussex.ac.uk>...
> >
> > I did some research and discovered that a faulty cable or drive can fry
> > your FireWire port -- this is what has happened to mine. Actually, the
> > FW chip is on the logic board, so to get FireWire going again I would
>
....
> If the FireWire host adapter IC is fried, then of course you're in a
> bad situation, but it's a better than even chance that it's a simple
> passive component(s) that's dead.

Could you tell me more about this? (Privately if you prefer.) I have
surveyed dozens of sites and forums online, all of which detail PHY
failures, which necessitates replacement of the motherboard.
Particularaly informative is:

http://www.wiebetech.com/pressreleases/FireWirePortFailures.htm

Nobody has suggested that it might be the less serious problem that you
describe -- however, if you know how I could test whether this is the
case, I'd be interested to know (I have little technical knowledge).

Thanks

John

On Wed, 2 Jul 2003 0:48:04 +0100, John Croft wrote
(in message <020720030048048619%j.croft[at]sussex.ac.uk>):

> Nobody has suggested that it might be the less serious problem that you
> describe -- however, if you know how I could test whether this is the
> case, I'd be interested to know (I have little technical knowledge).
>
> Thanks
>
> John

John,

Don't automatically assume that the problem is this fatal!
In your initial post you mentioned that the same thing was happening on 2
macs [at least I think you did]. I also had lots of problems with my external
firewire drive and trying to get it to mount on the desktop. It also happened
on a couple of macs! In the end, I managed to get it working consistently by
making sure that I powered it up first, until I could actually hear the disk
accelerate. Then I connected the FW cable to the mac and then to the drive...
this works every time now, although I will say that I had to take the drive
back to the shop and get it swapped for a new one as it got fried. Although,
I think that was a separate issue and not caused by the FW bus.

Still, try listening to the drive when you power it up [power cable only] and
see if it makes an increasing spinning noise, followed by a kind of click,
which lets you know that the device has successfully initiated, and then try
plugging it in.

HTH

dh.

John Croft <j.croft[at]sussex.ac.uk> wrote in message news:<020720030048048619%j.croft[at]sussex.ac.uk>...

> > If the FireWire host adapter IC is fried, then of course you're in a
> > bad situation, but it's a better than even chance that it's a simple
> > passive component(s) that's dead.
>
> Could you tell me more about this? (Privately if you prefer.) I have
> surveyed dozens of sites and forums online, all of which detail PHY
> failures, which necessitates replacement of the motherboard.
> Particularaly informative is:

I probably should have prefaced this by saying that I haven't got
experience with recent Apple motherboards, and I was speaking from
what I've observed on PCs and proprietary systems.

A schematic helps, but it's not necessary. The line of attack is to
verify continuity from the PHY to the connector. Check the polyfuses
to see if they are open-circuit. Check any series inductors to see if
they are open-circuit.

With that verified, the next thing is to see if there are shorts from
TPA+/- and TPB+/- to ground or power (they would be shorts to the
PHY's Vcc, not the power rail of the FireWire port - we're looking for
shorted protection diodes internal to the PHY).

Oh, and one hack that has been useful to me on occasion with PCs
(fixing fried USB ports) - oftentimes, machines with one external port
will have a dual-port chip, and you can cut-n-patch the connector
through to the second port.

In article <0001HW.BB287435009C7321F0284600[at]news.btopenworld.com>,
dilalio <d.heighington[at]SPAMNOTbtinternet.com> wrote:

> John,
>
> Don't automatically assume that the problem is this fatal!
> In your initial post you mentioned that the same thing was happening on 2
> macs [at least I think you did]. I also had lots of problems with my external
> firewire drive and trying to get it to mount on the desktop. It also happened
> on a couple of macs! In the end, I managed to get it working consistently by
> making sure that I powered it up first, until I could actually hear the disk
> accelerate.

Thanks for this -- I've actually tried every conceivable order or
powering on and plugging-in -- and it's not only two Macs but two
different drives, one of which works on a third mac! So, I'm not too
optimistic.

Thanks to Lewin also for the helpful information -- I'll investigate
the machine looking out for these things.

John

In article <010720031818387172%j.croft[at]sussex.ac.uk>, John Croft
<j.croft[at]sussex.ac.uk> wrote:

> In article <bds40v$108il7$1[at]ID-34660.news.dfncis.de>, Dennis Luemkemann
> <dennis.luemkemann[at]gmx.de> wrote:
>
> > John Croft wrote:
> > > Has any body else experienced this problem or know how to fix it?
> >
> > maybe something similar.
> >
> > I recently got a external hard disk case with Firewire and USB2
> > connectors, put my ex-internal 10GB disk in it and connected it to my
> > iBook (same as yours). The disk showed up and I could copy some stuff.
> > Then suddenly, it disappeared and since then I couldn't use it with
> > Firewire anymore, it would never mount or even be detected. Using the
> > USB connector, it worked.
>
> I did some research and discovered that a faulty cable or drive can fry
> your FireWire port -- this is what has happened to mine. Actually, the
> FW chip is on the logic board, so to get FireWire going again I would
> have to have that replaced, which all up would be over £400 -- not
> really worth it for my old iBook.
>
> Seems like a slightly deficient technology, if one faulty cable can
> cook your logic board...I hope this isn't the case with yours.


Unfortunately, I had the same happen to me. A perfectly healthy
external drive was connected to the FireWire port of my B&W G3. It
worked at first, but after a few times, suddenly it wouldn't mount.
Plugging the same drive into my iBook showed that the drive was
unreadable. Reformatting on the iBook brought the drive back to life,
but plugging it in into the G3 killed it again. So, the lesson is:
1. FireWire ports do get damaged
2. Once an external drive is connected to a damaged port, the content
of the drive may be lost (!!!)

What surprises me is that the iBook is a recent model, where these
problem of early FireWire ports have supposedly been fixed.

For a tower, the workaround is to buy a FireWire PCI card, but with an
iBook, you are stuck.

--
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