In article <986f3a10.0307080937.18e96d8[at]posting.google.com>,
sn00ge[at]hotmail.com (sn00ge) wrote:

> Greetings.
>
> I'm thinking about getting a new G4, possibly a 1.25/DP. Do any of the
> current G4s have analog audio line-in capability built-in?

All the mirror drive door Power Macs have audio line in and out jacks.

> If so, does
> it sound reasonably good? I'm thinking about digitizing some old
> cassettes and LP records.

No. If you are lucky it is just as crappy as any other line in option.
In many cases it is totally unusable because of interference from the
computer.

Do yourself a favor and get a decent USB audio input device.

--
Chicago, IL
Remove "GO" to reply.

In article <p-lefebvre-276640.20062208072003[at]reader1.news.rcn.net>,
Phil Lefebvre <p-lefebvre[at]GOnorthwestern.edu> wrote:

> > If so, does
> > it sound reasonably good? I'm thinking about digitizing some old
> > cassettes and LP records.
>
> No. If you are lucky it is just as crappy as any other line in option.
> In many cases it is totally unusable because of interference from the
> computer.

Nawww...I've used it on semi-pro projects and it's not as bad as you're
making it sound. He asked if it sounds "reasonably good" - and I say
yes. Digitizing cassettes and LPs? The source ain't that great to begin
with. That being said...

> Do yourself a favor and get a decent USB audio input device.

I agree. Unless he's just doing a couple of one-time things and really
doesn't need good quality even a cheap audio input is worth it.

Wanna buy my MOTU 828? :)

In article <p-lefebvre-276640.20062208072003[at]reader1.news.rcn.net>,
Phil Lefebvre <p-lefebvre[at]GOnorthwestern.edu> wrote:

> In article <986f3a10.0307080937.18e96d8[at]posting.google.com>,
> sn00ge[at]hotmail.com (sn00ge) wrote:
>
> > Greetings.
> >
> > I'm thinking about getting a new G4, possibly a 1.25/DP. Do any of the
> > current G4s have analog audio line-in capability built-in?
>
> All the mirror drive door Power Macs have audio line in and out jacks.
>
> > If so, does
> > it sound reasonably good? I'm thinking about digitizing some old
> > cassettes and LP records.
>
> No. If you are lucky it is just as crappy as any other line in option.
> In many cases it is totally unusable because of interference from the
> computer.
>
> Do yourself a favor and get a decent USB audio input device.

Are you just guessing or do you have some numbers to back up your
statements? I don't know about the G4s, but my Beige G3 has quite decent
specs for the audio input -- 85 dB SNR unweighted, THD 0.05%, 20 Hz-20
KHz is pretty close to professional audio performance, and *way* better
than any analog source you're going to run across.

I've digitized dozens of LPs and cassettes, both with an old 6100 (G3
enhanced) and with my current Beige G3; no audible noise *at all*, and
believe me, I've done enough recording, designing, and other audio work
to tell if it's there.

Isaac

Phil Lefebvre wrote:
> In article <986f3a10.0307080937.18e96d8[at]posting.google.com>,
> sn00ge[at]hotmail.com (sn00ge) wrote:
>
>
>>Greetings.
>>
>>I'm thinking about getting a new G4, possibly a 1.25/DP. Do any of the
>>current G4s have analog audio line-in capability built-in?
>
>
> All the mirror drive door Power Macs have audio line in and out jacks.
>
>
>> If so, does
>>it sound reasonably good? I'm thinking about digitizing some old
>>cassettes and LP records.
>
>
> No. If you are lucky it is just as crappy as any other line in option.
> In many cases it is totally unusable because of interference from the
> computer.
>
> Do yourself a favor and get a decent USB audio input device.
>


Which ones do you consider decent and about how much
should I expect to pay for it?

In article <3F0C674B.5040600[at]nospam.com>, asdfg <asdfg[at]nospam.com>
wrote:

> Which ones do you consider decent and about how much
> should I expect to pay for it?

I have an iMic...which I like--but I'm not an audiophile either. I am a
bit discriminating, however, and I've used it to digitize songs that I
recorded on a 4-track, as well as used to hook my mac up to a large
receiver. Both operations sounded pretty good to me.

--
|\/| /-| |2 |<
mehaase at sas dot upenn dot edu

In article <isw-02D852.23194808072003[at]netnews.attbi.com>,
Isaac Wingfield <isw[at]witzend.com> wrote:

> In article <p-lefebvre-276640.20062208072003[at]reader1.news.rcn.net>,
> Phil Lefebvre <p-lefebvre[at]GOnorthwestern.edu> wrote:
>
> > No. If you are lucky it is just as crappy as any other line in option.
> > In many cases it is totally unusable because of interference from the
> > computer.
> >
> > Do yourself a favor and get a decent USB audio input device.
>
> Are you just guessing or do you have some numbers to back up your
> statements? I don't know about the G4s, but my Beige G3 has quite decent
> specs for the audio input -- 85 dB SNR unweighted, THD 0.05%, 20 Hz-20
> KHz is pretty close to professional audio performance, and *way* better
> than any analog source you're going to run across.
>
> I've digitized dozens of LPs and cassettes, both with an old 6100 (G3
> enhanced) and with my current Beige G3; no audible noise *at all*, and
> believe me, I've done enough recording, designing, and other audio work
> to tell if it's there.

What does a Beige G3 or 6100 have to do with the new Power Macs? It's
like saying new Macs should have ADB ports just because old ones did. If
you don't know about the G4s, then don't comment about them.

For the record, I actually own a Power Mac G4 MDD, and I get terrible
audio interference. This issue is very well documented at G4noise.com.
Some machines have it worse than others. In some cases it even affects
analog _video_ capture cards. That is why I keep my Power Mac 8500
around, which had probably the best stock audio ports of any Mac made,
at least according to Apple.

Part of the reason Apple may have removed audio inputs is because they
were either unwilling or unable to shield the audio circuits from all
the noise the more powerful machines generate. They put it back per user
requests, but did a half-ass job at it.

--
Chicago, IL
Remove "GO" to reply.

Mark Haase wrote:
> In article <3F0C674B.5040600[at]nospam.com>, asdfg <asdfg[at]nospam.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>>Which ones do you consider decent and about how much
>>should I expect to pay for it?
>
>
> I have an iMic...which I like--but I'm not an audiophile either. I am a
> bit discriminating, however, and I've used it to digitize songs that I
> recorded on a 4-track, as well as used to hook my mac up to a large
> receiver. Both operations sounded pretty good to me.
>

Thanks. I see MacZone has it for 34.99, which isn't bad.

In article <3F0CF65A.9090003[at]nospam.com>, asdfg <asdfg[at]nospam.com>
wrote:

> Thanks. I see MacZone has it for 34.99, which isn't bad.

It's perfect for what you're looking for.

In article <p-lefebvre-6A6F96.20310509072003[at]reader1.news.rcn.net>,
Phil Lefebvre <p-lefebvre[at]GOnorthwestern.edu> wrote:
>
> For the record, I actually own a Power Mac G4 MDD, and I get terrible
> audio interference. This issue is very well documented at G4noise.com.
> Some machines have it worse than others. In some cases it even affects
> analog _video_ capture cards. That is why I keep my Power Mac 8500
> around, which had probably the best stock audio ports of any Mac made,
> at least according to Apple.
>
> Part of the reason Apple may have removed audio inputs is because they
> were either unwilling or unable to shield the audio circuits from all
> the noise the more powerful machines generate. They put it back per user
> requests, but did a half-ass job at it.
>

We heard the horror stories after our order had gone in for a major
studio upgrade. I can verify, the analog out on the MDD G4 has a nasty
intermittent buzz. It's not powerline buzz, it's about 10 - 20 hz pulses
for the fan speed control, and it seems to be leaking into the audio
circuit groundplane.

Now I can also verify that the annoying whine of the fan which pitches
up and down is present only in OS-9. Run that Mac in OS-X and the fan
speed is controlled by a totally different software. No buzz on the
audio, and the fan speed changes at about a hundred times slower than
OS-9, so it's not noticeable.

I would have expected it to be relatively trivial to hack the OS-9 Power
Management s/w to fix this , but why bother? The cure is to move to
OS-X. I know, we too were trapped in OS-9 for 6 months until DigiDesign
came thru with ProTools 6. Now we don't look back ;-)

Sure, we've got a Sony 24 bit digital desk, 2 x MDD G4s with ProTools
TDM, bells & whistles, + a bunch of eMacs, but for a quick burn to CD
from a cassette or vinyl the analog in to the G4 is quite adequate.

Disclaimer: I haven't had hands on to a Griffin iMic, but I've seen
reports suggesting they are only a toy, and that other brands may give
more options and better performance.

Phil Lefebvre wrote:
> In article <isw-02D852.23194808072003[at]netnews.attbi.com>,
> Isaac Wingfield <isw[at]witzend.com> wrote:
>
>
>>In article <p-lefebvre-276640.20062208072003[at]reader1.news.rcn.net>,
>> Phil Lefebvre <p-lefebvre[at]GOnorthwestern.edu> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>No. If you are lucky it is just as crappy as any other line in option.
>>>In many cases it is totally unusable because of interference from the
>>>computer.
>>>
>>>Do yourself a favor and get a decent USB audio input device.
>>
>>Are you just guessing or do you have some numbers to back up your
>>statements? I don't know about the G4s, but my Beige G3 has quite decent
>>specs for the audio input -- 85 dB SNR unweighted, THD 0.05%, 20 Hz-20
>>KHz is pretty close to professional audio performance, and *way* better
>>than any analog source you're going to run across.
>>
>>I've digitized dozens of LPs and cassettes, both with an old 6100 (G3
>>enhanced) and with my current Beige G3; no audible noise *at all*, and
>>believe me, I've done enough recording, designing, and other audio work
>>to tell if it's there.
>
>
> What does a Beige G3 or 6100 have to do with the new Power Macs? It's
> like saying new Macs should have ADB ports just because old ones did. If
> you don't know about the G4s, then don't comment about them.
>
> For the record, I actually own a Power Mac G4 MDD, and I get terrible
> audio interference. This issue is very well documented at G4noise.com.
> Some machines have it worse than others. In some cases it even affects
> analog _video_ capture cards. That is why I keep my Power Mac 8500
> around, which had probably the best stock audio ports of any Mac made,
> at least according to Apple.
>
> Part of the reason Apple may have removed audio inputs is because they
> were either unwilling or unable to shield the audio circuits from all
> the noise the more powerful machines generate. They put it back per user
> requests, but did a half-ass job at it.
>

I was planning to buy a G4 in a couple of weeks but now I'm having
second thoughts. I checked the G4noise.com site and the fix seems
to be to replace the power supply fan, which makes the computer
quieter when you are in the same room with it. But does that fix
the noise coming through the audio in and out?

Would an external USB sound card solve any problem with noisy
audio input/output jacks? Or would noise be transmitted through
that too?

Should I wait for a G5 or is that going to have the same
kind of problems?

In article <3F11D692.9020402[at]nospam.com>, mikken <nospam[at]nospam.com>
wrote:

> I was planning to buy a G4 in a couple of weeks but now I'm having
> second thoughts. I checked the G4noise.com site and the fix seems
> to be to replace the power supply fan, which makes the computer
> quieter when you are in the same room with it. But does that fix
> the noise coming through the audio in and out?

Sometimes it does, but you can't count on it.

> Would an external USB sound card solve any problem with noisy
> audio input/output jacks? Or would noise be transmitted through
> that too?

They should avoid it.

> Should I wait for a G5 or is that going to have the same
> kind of problems?

I would hope the G5's S/PDIFs should be able to avoid interference, but
we won't know until the audio engineers get a crack at it.

--
Chicago, IL
Remove "GO" to reply.

Phil Lefebvre wrote:
> In article <3F11D692.9020402[at]nospam.com>, mikken <nospam[at]nospam.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>>I was planning to buy a G4 in a couple of weeks but now I'm having
>>second thoughts. I checked the G4noise.com site and the fix seems
>>to be to replace the power supply fan, which makes the computer
>>quieter when you are in the same room with it. But does that fix
>>the noise coming through the audio in and out?
>
>
> Sometimes it does, but you can't count on it.
>
>
>>Would an external USB sound card solve any problem with noisy
>>audio input/output jacks? Or would noise be transmitted through
>>that too?
>
>
> They should avoid it.

Looks like that's what I'll be getting then.

Will I need to disable the built in sound somewhere or
will the Mac be happy with both cards?

(Sorry if that sounds like a bonehead question, but I'm
coming from a PC background where you'd have to disable
the onboard sound in the BIOS to avoid a conflict)


>>Should I wait for a G5 or is that going to have the same
>>kind of problems?
>
>
> I would hope the G5's S/PDIFs should be able to avoid interference, but
> we won't know until the audio engineers get a crack at it.
>

In article <3F1235B9.8010106[at]nospam.com>, mikken <nospam[at]nospam.com>
wrote:

> Will I need to disable the built in sound somewhere or
> will the Mac be happy with both cards?
>
> (Sorry if that sounds like a bonehead question, but I'm
> coming from a PC background where you'd have to disable
> the onboard sound in the BIOS to avoid a conflict)

Well, Macs don't have editable BIOS settings like that. Some devices may
need drivers. Regardless, the Sound Preference Panel and most audio
applications will have an input selection you can use to switch between
sound sources on the fly. I've had up to 5 sound sources on previous
Macs and the OS can usually keep them all straight without needing to
disable anything.

--
Chicago, IL
Remove "GO" to reply.